I have a problem

[Coffee Pom]

I have an HP Pavilion 8533z, and it has a power button that you hold for 8 secs to get the emergency shutoff during a freezeup or whatever. Well, lately when i try to turn it back on, the hard drive light comes on, stays on, and nothing happens. The computer won't restart, but the lights are on. So I have to turn it off again and let it sit for 5-10 mins before it will restart properly.

What's the deal? Is it my hard drive, power button, or what?


Celeron 500 mhz
128 RAM
10 gig HD


Any thoughts would be most welcome.


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[Coffee Pom]

Ok, i ran a Scan Disk in Norton and it turned out fine, but when i ran the Win Scan Disk, it froze on one of the clusters while doing the surface test. I'm thinking i might have a physical problem on my hard drive?

Anyone with any ideas??

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[tweakthis]

My first thought is overheating. Do you get many freezeups? Do you have crashguard installed? I used to find I had more crashes when I had that installed - especially unrecoverable ones. when i ran the Win Scan Disk, it froze on one of the clusters while doing the surface test I think that happened because you also have Norton installed. I had the same problem, now I don't use Norton.

I have heard of a programme called Rain that I think tests your cpu temp. Any other members know the link? Or any similar programme? Any other ideas?

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<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by tweakthis on March 01, 2001 at 06:31 PM</font>

[Coffee Pom]

I did not have Norton Crashguard installed, but i had all the other crap they give in Systemworks. Should i uninstall all of it? A friend of mine told me that Norton causes more problems than it fixes. Is it ok to just use the Anti-virus without all the other stuff and not have it affect my hard drive?

I don't get freezeups much except when i play games.

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[tweakthis]

Sure, you can uninstall everything else except anti-virus. If I remember correctly, Norton is only providing support for one year now anyway. You have to pay for subsequent upgrades/support.

You might be interested in Innoculate IT, it's free for the personal edition. I've used it for several years now. Computer Associates (http://antivirus.cai.com/) link.

I use the Win98 scandisk programme, but prefer WinMe's defrag...sucker is major fast! Email me if you want the file and instructions.

What games cause freezing?

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[Coffee Pom]

So far, it frozen up on BG2, Diablo 2, and Soldier of Fortune. I don't think it's the games that's doing it and the freezes don't really bother me. It's the fact that my computer won't restart for several minutes is what's making me worried. And when i run the scan disk, it freezes on the same cluster everytime. I think my hard drive is messed up. Unfortunately, it would cost me almost as much to get a new one as it would to get a system like mine, so i'm thinking about getting a whole new system and making it a 900-1000 mhz one. It's about that time anyway....

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[tweakthis]

OK, links first.
Finally found a site for Rain. Softseek (http://www.softseek.com/Utilities/Benchmarking_and_Tune_Up/D_18382_index.html) has a download site. Here's a link (http://www.benchtest.com/cooler.html) to benchtest.com. Read the review and check out other options. And a link to a VDR (http://discussions.virtualdr.com/Forum2/HTML/016237.html) thread that deals with overheating. There are probably more but this one was as far as I went. (Doh, never thought to ask Glussier if he had a link. Live and learn!)
Oh, and here's (http://softseek.zdnet.com/Utilities/Benchmarking_and_Tune_Up/Review_11390_index.html) a link for SiSoft Sandra, a 32-bit Windows system information and diagnostic utility.

OK, the reason I keep saying 'overheating' is because of the length of time it takes for the system to reboot. That says to me it needs time to cool before it can start again.

I'm not disputing that there might also be a hard drive problem but you said no bad clusters were found using Norton. Did you delete Norton and then try Win98's scandisk? You might indeed have a bad cluster but I've never had it hang on a bad cluster...it should mark it bad and move on. Doesn't mean it won't happen, I've just never experienced it. If you have one, you'll get more bad clusters. How come so much to get a new hard drive? Because it's HP?

However, if you're looking for a reason to get a new 'puter...this might be the right opportunity. Good luck. http://www.helpfromtechs.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif Hope the links help.

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<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by tweakthis on March 04, 2001 at 09:43 AM</font>

[Coffee Pom]

Wow, thanks for all the links. I didn't even know where to look.

Yes, i did take out Norton and then run the scan disk again. And again it froze on the clusters. I don't get it. Why would it suddenly overheat? I let it sit all day and nothing happens but then i play a game or run scan disk and it freezes. Do those activities cause more heat than just using Office or something else?

I checked my fan and it's running fine.

And no, i'm not really looking for a reason to get a new system. I just don't want to spend 100's on this one in the hopes that it will pan out over the long haul. I would love to fix this little problem and move on.

Well, let me check all the links and see what i can turn up. Thanks again!

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[Coffee Pom]

Ok, i installed Rain and the little icon is down there in the bottom corner, but when i click on it, all i get is a small window with the logo. There are no gauges, etc, or info. Is that it? How do i know it's running? Will it warn me when things overheat or just work silently?

Thanks!

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[HKEd]

Hi Coffee Pom...the only way to tell that Rain is running is System Monitor (or whatever sysinfo software you have on your system) will show the processor usage at 100%. What Rain is doing is "controlling" the processor, shutting off areas not in use so that heat is able to dissipate quicker. It works silently. If you deactivate Rain (by right-clicking on the systray icon), you will see processor usage drop down to normal levels. The 100% usage is not an accurate figure - it's just the way Rain is designed to operate.

Hope this helps.

[Pure Luck]

I may be mistaken but I doubt if Rain would help if you're freezing up during intense activity. I thought it was designed to keep your cpu cool while it's idling and shut's itself off when other things start working. If you want to monitor your temps, you can try MotherBoard Monitor. You can get it here (http://mbm.livewiredev.com/) Can't gaurantee it'll work on your system but it won't hurt to try. I prefer the version 4 over the newer version 5.
Or can you get your hands on another hard drive to test with? That could rule the hd out if the same thing occurs.

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<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Pure Luck on March 05, 2001 at 09:18 PM</font>

[Dogg of Demise]

You might try cleaning the dust out of your cpu fan and heatsink and check the fan in the powersupply to see if its pluged up.(and even the vent holes in the case)

PS If motherboard moniter doesn't work Sysoft Sandra will also tell you temps and fan rpm's
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<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Dogg of Demise on March 05, 2001 at 09:52 PM</font>

[glussier]

Your problem could be the power supply which is getting weak, or a connector which is no seated properly. Take off the computer case and check all connectors making sure that they are all seated properly.

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[tweakthis]

First, thanks to everyone for the help with 'rain' and offering suggestions for solving the problems Coffee Pom is having.

Coffee Pom, I had another thought re win 98 scandisk, can you run it in safe mode? I'm not sure it will help, I'm just curious. As I said, I dumped the Norton stuff because of the numerous problems. I think you may be having problems with a certain cluster because, and I'm digging back in the memory banks here, when Norton deletes stuff it puts in it a 'secure' file. Maybe some sort of security programme won't let you scan the sectors where the 'secure file' is? Oops, just realized you said you took out Norton. Everything? Maybe the hd is going south. I'm just about out of ideas for that problem. Anyone else have any ideas/suggestions?
BTW - you're welcome for the links. http://www.helpfromtechs.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

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[Pure Luck]

Might even try booting to dos and running scandisk from there.

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[Coffee Pom]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. This is my update. I keep the Rain icon going on the bottom right corner, so i think it's running although the system monitor only says 10-15%. Anyway, i don't know how else to make it go since there are no controls to speak of.

I did clean out my case and removed all the dust etc and checked the fans and connections. Everything seems to be running fine.

I have not had a freezeup since installing Rain, so i can't tell if the power will come straight back on or not. I guess i'll just wait and see. I have not had time to play any games, but i will try them this weekend.

Thanks again for the help! I hope that Rain did it.

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[Dogg of Demise]

If Rain has helped most likely you DO have a heat problem. Your cpu is at risk! I would realy advise you to check/replace your cpu fan and check for pluged up vents and PS fan.

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[tweakthis]

Hey there, coffee pom, just wanted to check in and see how your system is running. How's 'rain' handling the games?

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[Coffee Pom]

Hey guys,

Sorry i haven't had time to post the last couple days. This is my latest update. I took open the whole unit, cleaned all the dust out and replaced the CPU fan as suggested. It wasn't running, so i think it was blown. It also had a MOUNTAIN of dust on it. http://www.helpfromtechs.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

Haven't had a crash or freeze since then. I uninstalled Rain to see if that would do anything and no change. So i think it was the CPU fan and probably all the dust caked on the motherboard didn't help either. LOL.

Thanks for all the good advice. Since then, i've bought a book on maintaining computers and i'm learning a lot more about hardware. It's amazing how little i knew about what was going on inside that box. *grin*

Thanks again!!
http://www.helpfromtechs.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif


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[Pure Luck]

Hey, good deal. Glad that bad fan didn't make toast outa your cpu.

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[Coffee Pom]

Yeah, me too. http://www.helpfromtechs.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif

Hey, maybe this site should make a checklist of common hardware issues that all users should be aware of. Or is there one already? Just a thot.

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[Bounced Reality Check]

sort of late, but, tweakthis : you asked if scandisk could be run in safe mode... i'm not sure about that, but you can run msconfig, and choose "Selective boot", and un- check "startup menu items", then virus scans etc won't interfere with the scan.
This was a great line of posts!

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